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Jesus or Mohammed- who is Christ?
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Deuteronomy 24:16- NIV

16 Parents are not to be put to death for their children, nor children put to death for their parents; each will die for their own sin.

000002.jpg?w=194

Church makes Jesus divine, and says that he died for the sins of humans. But what was Early Christian Beliefs?

Paul's Letters are the earliest written and only 6 out of 14 letters of him are regared originally written by him by Biblical Scholars, and we shall analyse them.

1 Thessalonians 4:14 For we believe that Jesus died and rose again, and so we believe that God will bring with Jesus those who have fallen asleep in him.15 According to the Lord’s word, we tell you that we who are still alive, who are left until the coming of the Lord, will certainly not precede those who have fallen asleep. 16 For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first.

 



-- Edited by devapriya solomon on Friday 18th of May 2012 03:36:42 PM

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1 Corinthians 15:51 Listen, I tell you a mystery: We will not all Die, but we will all be changed — 52 in a flash, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed.

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Philippians 1:In all my prayers for all of you, I always pray with joybecause of your partnership in the gospel from the first day until now, being confident of this, that he who began a good work in you will carry it on to completion until the day of Christ Jesus.

1 Thessalonians 1:10

10 and to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead —Jesus, who rescues us from the coming wrath.

1 Thessalonians 4:17

After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever.

Galatians 1:Grace and peace to you from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ, who gave himself for our sins to rescue us from the present evil age, according to the will of our God and Father,



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Romans 8: 1Therefore, there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus, because through Christ Jesus the law of the Spirit who gives life has set you[a] free from the law of sin and death.

18 I consider that our present sufferings are not worth comparing with the glory that will be revealed in us. 19 For the creation waits in eager expectation for the children of God to be revealed.

 


 



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Galatians 4: 4 But when the set time had fully come, God sent his Son, born of a woman, born under the law, 

Romans 1:regarding his Son, who as to his earthly life[a] was a descendant of David

 

As per Jewish Mythologies David is the only King who ruled Judea and Israel and as per the story- his Son Solomon- who was the Son of Bethsheba- King David when the Country was Under war and saw Bethsheba wife of Uria the Soldier, called her and had Intercourse(Rape?); then asked Uria to have sex with bethsheba- but as all Soldiers are under promise to LORD-Uria refused -hence Kind David got Uria killed then Married Bethsheba.

This relation's son was Solomon.

David had to walk in Street Naked-to please LORD of this Sins.

 images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTiNK0iWWWPm47XKdAtzJ4SbtyEBx_Ce8Xc0IlmZ0In6ZyG3H6-

Archeology says -Judea was an unoccupied small place during this period. David and Solomon could have been some village heads.



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Other than Paul's 6 letter all other books- authors are unknown and church has given the names to make people to belive that these are eye withness accounts -whis is not.

How about Other writers say

1 Peter 1who through faith are shielded by God’s power until the coming of the salvation that is ready to be revealed in the last time.

20 He was chosen before the creation of the world, but was revealed in these last times for your sake.

1 Peter 4:7 The end of all things is near. 

17 For it is time for judgment to begin with God’s household; and if it begins with us, what will the outcome be for those who do not obey the gospel of God? 


1 John 2: 18 Dear children, this is the last hour; and as you have heard that the antichrist is coming, even now many antichrists have come. This is how we know it is the last hour. 



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Jude 1: 17 But, dear friends, remember what the apostles of our Lord Jesus Christ foretold18 They said to you, “In the last times there will be scoffers who will follow their own ungodly desires.” 19 These are the people who divide you, who follow mere natural instincts and do not have the Spirit.

Hebrews 9: 26 Otherwise Christ would have had to suffer many times since the creation of the world. But he has appeared once for all at the culmination of the ages to do away with sin by the sacrifice of himself.

27 Just as people are destined to die once, and after that to face judgment28 so Christ was sacrificed once to take away the sins of many; and he will appear a second time, not to bear sin, but to bring salvation to those who are waiting for him.



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The writers of these letters expected world ending in their Life time.

Paul does not know the Historical Jesus, and he expected world ending from the teachings of resusticated Jesus!

 

But what does Gospel Hero Jesus say?

Matthew 10: These twelve Jesus sent out with the following instructions: Do not go among the Gentiles or enter any town of the SamaritansGo Only to the lost sheep of IsraelAs you go, proclaim this message: ‘The kingdom of heaven has come near.’

Matthew 10: 23 When you are persecuted in one place, flee to another. Truly I tell you, you will not finish going through the towns of Israel before the Son of Man comes.

Mark 9:1And he said to them, Truly I tell you, some who are standing here will not taste death before they see that the kingdom of God has come with power.



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Mark 13: 29 Even so, when you see these things happening, you know that it is near, right at the door. 30 Truly I tell you, the people living now will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened. 31 Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will never pass away.

what will all happen

24 “But in those days, following that distress,

“‘the sun will be darkened,
    and the moon will not give its light;
25 the stars will fall from the sky,
    and the heavenly bodies will be shaken.’[c]

26 “At that time people will see the Son of Man coming in clouds with great power and glory. 27 And he will send his angels and gather his elect from the four winds, from the ends of the earth to the ends of the heavens.



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Jesus is reported to have told the Jewish Pastors and High-Bishop 

Mark 14:61 But Jesus remained silent and gave no answer.

Again the high priest asked him, “Are you the Messiah, the Son of the Blessed One?”

62 “I am,” said Jesus. “And you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right hand of the Mighty One and coming on the clouds of heaven.”

Jesus said - nobody would light a lamp and keep under a Cot, but put in a higher place- so if at all Jesus would have done angy Magic are resurrection- he would have done it before many, but we have nothing like it.



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We can also see Jesus said all the Jewish mythology ends with John the Baptist- Is he Messiah? 

Matthew 11:12 From the days of John the Baptist until now, the kingdom of heaven has been subjected to violence,[d] and violent people have been raiding it. 13 For all the Prophets and the Law prophesied until John14 And if you are willing to accept it, he is the Elijah who was to come15 Whoever has ears, let them hear.

 

John the Baptist says what? 

John 1:21 They asked him, “Then who are you? Are you Elijah?” John the Baptist said, “I am not.”“Are you the Prophet?”  He answered, “No.”




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Jesus is made a Divine person and what did Jesus say about himself?

John 6:48 I am the bread of life. 49 Your ancestors ate the manna in the wilderness, yet they died50 But here is the bread that comes down from heaven, which anyone may eat and not die. 51 I am the living bread that came down from heaven. Whoever eats this bread will live forever. This bread is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.”

images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQET_L9YX1-R8gkKvY6jmzxBvmQHusi3Ve4Hs3_2yFw97zvfUi50j8F0saTxA

John 6:58 This is the bread that came down from heaven. Your ancestors ate manna and died, but whoever feeds on this bread will live forever.” 59 He said this while teaching in the synagogue in Capernaum.




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Jesus gave Bread to One of the CHOSEN APOSTLES

What happened

John 13:26 ... Then, dipping the piece of bread, JESUS gave it to Judas, the son of Simon Iscariot. 27 As soon as Judas took the bread, Satan entered into him.

 

Now let us see Authour of 4th Gospel identifies as a Disciple and claims that what Resusticated Jesus told them? 

John 21:20 Peter turned and saw that the disciple whom Jesus loved was following them. (This was the one who had leaned back against Jesus at the supper and had said, “Lord, who is going to betray you?”)21 When Peter saw him, he asked, “Lord, what about him?”

22 Jesus answered, “If I want him to remain alive until I return, what is that to you? You must follow me.” 23 Because of this, the rumor spread among the believers that this disciple would not die. But Jesus did not say that he would not die; JESUS only said, “If I want him to remain alive until I return, what is that to you?”

24 This is the disciple who testifies to these things and who wrote them down. We know that his testimony is true.

Now this Beloved Disciple - Is he still alive?



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Sadducces were the High Bishops of Judaism till the war 65-70; later Pharisees took over.

They occupied the Chair of Moses as Jesus referred.

 

Acts 4:1 The priests and the captain of the temple guard and the Sadducees came up to Peter and John while they were speaking to the people. They were greatly disturbed because the apostles were teaching the people, proclaiming in Jesus the resurrection of the dead.

Paul claimed that Resusticated Jesus appeared to him and 500 others. Paul was arrested when all Apostles were in Jerusalem- Did he called any of this 500 for witness-No but what he did?

 

Acts 23:    Then Paul, knowing that some of them were Sadducees and the others Pharisees, called out in the Sanhedrin, “My brothers, I am a Phariseedescended from Pharisees. I stand on trial because of the hope of the resurrection of the dead.”When he said this, a dispute broke out between the Pharisees and the Sadducees, and the assembly was divided. (The Sadducees say that there is no resurrection,and that there are neither angels nor spirits, but the Pharisees believe all these things.)

images?q=tbn:ANd9GcToom4d100q_e5hCrXRyxZVOSGP5GGtcNmiZXMVIhoNlDPKYqdTmg

As for the Bible in Hebrew does not have any Messiah -Spirits etc., all these are sectarian Jewish beliefs, expecting world ending in their Life time.

Now who is Christ ?

 

 

 



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A discussion went on between Sakshi Network church and TNTJ

சாக்‌ஷி குழு Vs TNTJ குழுவினருடன் ”பைபிள் இறைவேதமா?” என்ற தலைப்பில் நடந்த விவாத வீடியோக்கள் – PJ தோற்று ஓடினார்http://iemtindia.com/?p=194

http://onlinepj.com/bayan-video/vivathangal/debate-bible/

குர்ஆன் இறைவேதமா?விவாத வீடியோ முழுமையாக வெளியிடப்பட்டுவிட்டது.”Is the Quran God’s Word?”FULL VIDEOS

http://onlinepj.com/bayan-video/vivathangal/quran-is-gods-word-debate-video/

 

உங்கள் கட்டுரை இருவருமே படித்து பதில் தருவார்களா?



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Christian site has not approved my following site till now.

 

rafeeque Mohammad May 18, 2012 at 5:03 pm

Your comment is awaiting moderation.

இரண்டு பக்கமும் சொன்னதையே திருப்பி திருப்பிச் சொன்னனர்.

ஆனால்- தொழுகை, ஜகாத், ஹஜ், சுன்னத் எதுவ்ம் குரானில் இல்லை எனத் தெளிவாக காட்டினீர்.

இணைய வேகம் மிகக் குறைவு. தயவு செய்து ஆடிஅயோ மட்டும் தர இயலுமா?

இக்கட்டுரைக்கு பதில் தர இயலுமா?
http://devapriyaji.activeboard.com/t49213357/jesus-or-mohammed-who-is-christ/?page=last#lastPostAnchor

REPLY



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Sir,

Thanks for your post  and showing that they have not approved your comment linking this site. They might do it today.

 

This is not a debate on truth, but on their beliefs based on their Mythologies, both of which have been proved wrong long back.

 

If SAN is willing for a debate in writing in net based on bible and Christian Theological researches- we welcome always.



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  • Personal verbal attacks will be deleted.
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Name:Devapriya Solomon
E-maildevapriyasolomon@gmail.com
Homepagehttp://devapriyaji.activeboard.com
Title:Who is Christ?
Comment:

sm_smile.gif sm_biggrin.gif sm_wink.gif sm_cool.gif sm_razz.gif
sm_rolleyes.gif sm_bigeek.gif sm_upset.gif sm_sleep.gif sm_sigh.gif
sm_confused.gif sm_cry.gif sm_mad.gif sm_dead.gif
Now I have analysed claims of Paul and Jesus from New Testament and felt neither Jesus nor Muhaammad can be called Christ or the last Prophet.

One rafeeque Mohammad had visited my thread and put in responses to your Tamil website on discussion with TNTJ and linked your site.
http://devapriyaji.activeboard.com/t49213357/jesus-or-mohammed-who-is-christ/

In your above talk with TNTJ You said that neither Muslims not Christians can claim authority over Old Testament. On that basis can you say that Do Jews agree that Messiah is already born and who they consider-Mohammed or Jesus.
Code:* 
  

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This is posted in and yet to be published

http://www.sak****imes.org/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=158&Itemid=43



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Sir, they have removed the link I gave for your site, and not replied you.

 

Your post in http://www.sak****imes.org/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=158&Itemid=43

is not published proving dishonesty.



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Sir,

 

You are using a better tamil version, please tell me what it is?

 

Our Churchses never tell us what you have said. And From Paul to all died like Jesus. so where is christ?



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Welcome Mr.Peter Selvanayakam

ஆதாமின் பாவம் என்று ஒன்று கிடையவே கிடையாது.

எபிரெயர்கள் அப்படி ஒன்று பற்றி என்றுமே சிந்திததே இல்லை. இயேசு இது பற்றி ஒரு வார்த்தை கூட பேசவே இல்லை.

வர வேண்டிய கிறிஸ்து ஆதி பாவம் நீக்குவார் என்பது கிடையவே கிடையாது.

அவரவர் பாவம் மட்டுமே அவரவர்கட்கு என்பதை பல நியாயப் பிரமாண சட்டங்கள், மற்றும் தீர்க்கர்கள் கூறுகின்றன. கீழே காணலாம்.

உபாகமம்: 24: 16
பிள்ளைகளுக்காகப் பிதாக்களும்,பிதாக்களுக்காகப் பிள்ளைகளும் கொலை செய்யப்படவேண்டாம்; அவனவன் செய்த பாவத்தினிமித்தம் அவனவன் கொலைசெய்யப்படவேண்டும்.
எரேமியா: 31:29பிதாக்கள் திராட்சக்காய்களைத் தின்றார்கள், பிள்ளைகளின் பற்கள் கூசிப்போயின என்று அந்நாட்களில் சொல்லமாட்டார்கள்.30. அவனவன் தன்தன் அக்கிரமத்தினிமித்தமே சாவான்; எந்த மனுஷன் திராட்சக்காய்களைத் தின்பானோ அவனுடைய பற்களே கூசிப்போகும்.
எசேக்கியேல்: 18:1. கர்த்தருடைய வார்த்தை எனக்கு உண்டாகி, அவர்,2. பிதாக்கள் திராட்சக்காய்களைத் தின்றார்கள், பிள்ளைகளின் பற்கள் கூசிப்போயின என்னும் பழமொழியை நீங்கள் இஸ்ரவேல் தேசத்தைக் குறித்துச்சொல்லுகிறது என்ன?3. இனி இஸ்ரவேலில் இந்தப் பழமொழியைச் சொல்வது இல்லை என்பதை என் ஜீவனைக்கொண்டு சொல்லுகிறேன் என்று, கர்த்தராகிய ஆண்டவர் உரைக்கிறார்.4. இதோ, எல்லா ஆத்துமாக்களும் என்னுடையவைகள்; தகப்பனின் ஆத்துமா எப்படியோ, அப்படியே மகனின் ஆத்துமாவும் என்னுடையது; பாவஞ்செய்கிற ஆத்துமாவே சாகும்.

எசேக்கியேல்: 18:20. பாவஞ்செய்கிற ஆத்துமாவே சாகும்; குமாரன் தகப்பனுடைய அக்கிரமத்தைச் சுமப்பதுமில்லை, தகப்பன் குமாரனுடைய அக்கிரமத்தைச் சுமப்பதுமில்லை; நீதிமானுடைய நீதி அவன்மேல்தான் இருக்கும், துன்மார்க்கனுடைய துன்மார்க்கமும் அவன்மேல்தான் இருக்கும்

ஏசாயா: 3:10. உங்களுக்கு நன்மையுண்டாகும் என்று நீதிமான்களுக்குச் சொல்லுங்கள்; அவர்கள் தங்கள் கிரியைகளின் பலனை அநுபவிப்பார்கள்.

ஆதாமின் பாவம் என்பது நாத்திகர்களையும்விட கடவுளை கேவலப் படுத்தும் கடவுள் விரோதக் கொள்கை வேறு இருக்க முடியாது.



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Mr.Jerry Thomas, Venkatesand and co will certainly reply this thread- and it is sure that they have seen your post and said links removed.
 
May be not here, If Jerry and Sakshi is honest they must do it atleast in their own website or www.tamilchristians.com


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//உபாகமம்: 24: 16
பிள்ளைகளுக்காகப் பிதாக்களும்,பிதாக்களுக்காகப் பிள்ளைகளும் கொலை செய்யப்படவேண்டாம்; அவனவன் செய்த பாவத்தினிமித்தம் அவனவன் கொலைசெய்யப்படவேண்டும்.
எரேமியா: 31:29பிதாக்கள் திராட்சக்காய்களைத் தின்றார்கள், பிள்ளைகளின் பற்கள் கூசிப்போயின என்று அந்நாட்களில் சொல்லமாட்டார்கள்.30. அவனவன் தன்தன் அக்கிரமத்தினிமித்தமே சாவான்; எந்த மனுஷன் திராட்சக்காய்களைத் தின்பானோ அவனுடைய பற்களே கூசிப்போகும்.
எசேக்கியேல்: 18:1. கர்த்தருடைய வார்த்தை எனக்கு உண்டாகி, அவர்,2. பிதாக்கள் திராட்சக்காய்களைத் தின்றார்கள், பிள்ளைகளின் பற்கள் கூசிப்போயின என்னும் பழமொழியை நீங்கள் இஸ்ரவேல் தேசத்தைக் குறித்துச்சொல்லுகிறது என்ன?3. இனி இஸ்ரவேலில் இந்தப் பழமொழியைச் சொல்வது இல்லை என்பதை என் ஜீவனைக்கொண்டு சொல்லுகிறேன் என்று, கர்த்தராகிய ஆண்டவர் உரைக்கிறார்.4. இதோ, எல்லா ஆத்துமாக்களும் என்னுடையவைகள்; தகப்பனின் ஆத்துமா எப்படியோ, அப்படியே மகனின் ஆத்துமாவும் என்னுடையது; பாவஞ்செய்கிற ஆத்துமாவே சாகும்.//

Dear Sir,

Your quote is interesting 

மத்தேயு

17 நியாயப்பிரமாணத்தையானாலும் தீர்க்கதரிசனங்களையானாலும் அழிக்கிறதற்கு வந்தேன் என்று எண்ணிக்கொள்ளாதேயுங்கள்,அழிக்கிறதற்கு அல்ல, நிறைவேற்றுகிறதற்கே வந்தேன்.

18 வானமும் பூமியும் ஒழிந்துபோனாலும், நியாயப்பிரமாணத்திலுள்ளதெல்லாம் நிறைவேறுமளவும், அதில் ஒரு சிறு எழுத்தாகிலும், ஒரு எழுத்தின் உறுப்பாகிலும் ஒழிந்துபோகாது என்று மெய்யாகவே உங்களுக்குச் சொல்லுகிறேன்.

19 ஆகையால், இந்தக் கற்பனைகள் எல்லாவற்றிலும் சிறிதானதொன்றையாகிலும் மீறி, அவ்விதமாய் மனுஷருக்குப் போதிக்கிறவன் பரலோகராஜ;யத்தில் எல்லாரிலும் சிறியவன் என்னப்படுவான், இவைகளைக் கைக்கொண்டு போதிக்கிறவனோ, பரலோகராஜ;யத்தில் பெரியவன் என்னப்படுவான்.

20 வேதபாரகர் பரிசேயர் என்பவர்களுடைய நீதியிலும் உங்கள் நீதி அதிகமாயிராவிட்டால், பரலோகராஜ;யத்தில் பிரவேசிக்கமாட்டீர்கள் என்று உங்களுக்குச் சொல்லுகிறேன்.

Now how does church then tells that Blood of Jesus can kill all sins.



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Member

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There is reportedly a debate on Jesus or Muhammad

Jesus or Muhammad Marathon Starts Tonight!

 

Here's the lineup for our "Jesus or Muhammad" marathon, which begins tonight on ABN:

Wednesday: 8:00 P.M. (EST)
Thursday: 8:00 P.M. (EST)
Friday: 10:00 P.M. (EST)
Saturday: 10:30 P.M. (EST)
Monday: 8:00 P.M./10:00 P.M. (EST)

If you don't get ABN via satellite, you can watch live over the internet here.

http://www.answeringmuslims.com/2012/06/jesus-or-muhammad-marathon-starts.html

I have posted comment asking them to comment this thread



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Welcome Dear Friend,

As we saw with Sakshi Apologetic Network did not give your link and neither here or in their site responded I do not expect 

David wood to be in search of Truth, he may not approve your comment or even he does would remove link as 

http://iemtindia.com/?p=333.

They are True Christians of Paul Order making money and not interested to reveal truth.



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